ATVs: destructive and costly use of RI State Park
Posted by: Wilhite
in Environment
on February 09, 2010 
This past Sunday afternoon, my wife, a friend of ours, and I went for a hike in the northern portion of Snake Den State Park and were infuriated to see not just 4-wheeler ATVs on the trails, but two Jeep Wranglers and a separate Jeep Cherokee. Yes, the trucks... on the trails, in the canyon. I almost burst an artery. To boot, there were a couple of individuals also illegally tearing up the trails with their 4-wheeler ATVs.
The trails, especially the trail that goes down into the canyon, were pretty scuffed up - just waiting for the next rain or melt to erode away. Of course the outdoor experience was greatly compromised by the sound of the engines heaving and revving and the tires squealing and skidding.
This is a perfect example of the destruction of a natural area that we all own and maintain with our tax dollars because a couple people take it upon themselves to disrespect and disregard the commons. We don't have a lot of our natural heritage and legacy left in Rhode Island. So a couple of yayhoos are tearing up what's left.
What the hell is wrong with walking??? All of these folks were perfectly able to hike along the trail. The crazy thing is that they had to squeeze their way between the boulders blocking the trail and the hill adjacent to get their trucks in there.
I got their license plate numbers.
I wrote to the DEM about it. This is part of my report:
At roughly 3:00 pm, we started our hike from Brown Road toward the canyon area of Snake Den Park and immediately came across two Jeep Wranglers driving out of the canyon. The license plates of the two Wranglers were RI plates ###-### and XX-###. The trail was noticeably damaged by tire tracks. We continued our hike along the trail and then eastward toward the swamp creek that constitutes the northern portion of the park and what I believe is the East Branch Pocasset River (?). While crossing the creek, we witnessed a white Jeep Cherokee driving along the canyon trail. Afterward, toward the end of our hike while emerging from the canyon back toward Brown Road, we witnessed two four-wheeler ATVs on the the same trail, headed back toward the canyon area.
I only hope that the DEM has enough funding to enforce the law and work to keep illegal motorized use out of our state parks.
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written by right_of_center, February 08, 2010
Good for you, Wilhite. Hopefully someone will go after them. My neighborhood has these people zipping up and down the road on their ATVs and off-road bikes. The cops can't catch them since they're only about a 1/4 mile from the woods they're going for and once they're in there, they're gone. I just want to set up a clothesline in front of my house, but I guess that's illegal too.
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written by forsanri, February 08, 2010
With 43+ Rhode Island Police Departments, surely you can find somebody willing to make some revenue off this.
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written by leftyrite, February 09, 2010
Cynicism is destroying what's left of liberal culture, as defined as the belief system of the "free man."
So many people have managed to thrive upon plunder, putting themselves forward as examples in the process, that those who reside on the margins tend to say, "What the f@#%? If they can do it, so can I."
And so it goes.
Finking to the authorities, however, is creepy in itself. You want to put a stop to bad behavior because it offends your sensibilities? That's not virtuous enough.
You'll have to put more skin in the game.
(I'm listening to myself as I write this, and it's making me feel queasy. Time for an antacid--or for more virtue, I guess.)
So many people have managed to thrive upon plunder, putting themselves forward as examples in the process, that those who reside on the margins tend to say, "What the f@#%? If they can do it, so can I."
And so it goes.
Finking to the authorities, however, is creepy in itself. You want to put a stop to bad behavior because it offends your sensibilities? That's not virtuous enough.
You'll have to put more skin in the game.
(I'm listening to myself as I write this, and it's making me feel queasy. Time for an antacid--or for more virtue, I guess.)
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written by right_of_center, February 09, 2010
"Finking to the authorities, however, is creepy in itself."
Hmm, so I can come by and punch you in the nose and you won't "fink to the authorities"? I can rob your house and you won't "find to the authorities"? C'mon. People are breaking the law and Wilhite is doing what is right, standing up for the law-abiding citizens instead of sitting by watching a couple idiots ruin it for everyone.
Hmm, so I can come by and punch you in the nose and you won't "fink to the authorities"? I can rob your house and you won't "find to the authorities"? C'mon. People are breaking the law and Wilhite is doing what is right, standing up for the law-abiding citizens instead of sitting by watching a couple idiots ruin it for everyone.
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written by North End Chick, February 09, 2010
A letter could have been written, I agree with that aspect of your post. However, was it necessary to include the license plates? Yes, that makes you a tattle tale.
Living in Western Cranston, 25 years ago it was nothing but farm land. My street was only paved so far and the rest was a dirt road. The dirt roads led to other devlopments so it was a great place for ATVS and dirt bikes. The neighbors biggest concern was the rate of speed these instruments went as they sped to the vacant area, past the homes that contained small children.
For 20 some odd years we didn't have a problem. When my brother showed interest in a dirt bike, my parents gladly purchased him a used bike for his new hobby.
That is what that it is a hobby. For kids interested it is something that keeps them out of trouble. Would you rather have seen them dealing drugs to the hikers?
Living in Western Cranston, 25 years ago it was nothing but farm land. My street was only paved so far and the rest was a dirt road. The dirt roads led to other devlopments so it was a great place for ATVS and dirt bikes. The neighbors biggest concern was the rate of speed these instruments went as they sped to the vacant area, past the homes that contained small children.
For 20 some odd years we didn't have a problem. When my brother showed interest in a dirt bike, my parents gladly purchased him a used bike for his new hobby.
That is what that it is a hobby. For kids interested it is something that keeps them out of trouble. Would you rather have seen them dealing drugs to the hikers?
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written by Contrarian View, February 09, 2010
@right-of-center: I am a motorcyclist. If you were to put any kind of line across a street to "catch" riders, I would gladly volunteer to be the executioner after your murder conviction.
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written by right_of_center, February 09, 2010
Where did I say either:
1. I have a problem with motorcyclists? My problem is with the 14 year olds on their ATVs flying up and down the road and with the dirt bike kids doing the same.
2. That I would actually do it. You've never had a thought of something you'd "like" to do, but know it is wrong and never would? Wish I were you.
1. I have a problem with motorcyclists? My problem is with the 14 year olds on their ATVs flying up and down the road and with the dirt bike kids doing the same.
2. That I would actually do it. You've never had a thought of something you'd "like" to do, but know it is wrong and never would? Wish I were you.
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written by DeusEx, February 09, 2010
I agree that complaining to the police is lame, although if you think they are going to do anything about it then you're dreaming - far too much effort when they can just write tickets all day on the main roads and raise revenue for themselves.
Actually, if somebody punched me in the face, no, I wouldn't go running to the police, I would stand up for myself. As for robberies, they never find anything anyway, so it doesn't matter if you involve them or not.
Actually, if somebody punched me in the face, no, I wouldn't go running to the police, I would stand up for myself. As for robberies, they never find anything anyway, so it doesn't matter if you involve them or not.
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written by PinkHatLib, February 09, 2010
Clearly the solution to so many of our problems today!
http://theyesmen.org/hijinks/wharton
[quote]Philadelphia - At a Wharton Business School conference on business in Africa, World Trade Organization representative Hanniford Schmidt announced the creation of a WTO initiative for "full private stewardry of labor" for the parts of Africa that have been hardest hit by the 500 years of Africa's free trade with the West.
The initiative will require Western companies doing business in some parts of Africa to own their workers outright. Schmidt recounted how private stewardship has been successfully applied to transport, power, water, traditional knowledge, and even the human genome. The WTO's "full private stewardry" program will extend these successes to (re)privatize humans themselves.
"Full, untrammelled stewardry is the best available solution to African poverty, and the inevitable result of free-market theory," Schmidt told more than 150 attendees. Schmidt acknowledged that the stewardry program was similar in many ways to slavery, but explained that just as "compassionate conservatism" has polished the rough edges on labor relations in industrialized countries, full stewardry, or "compassionate slavery," could be a similar boon to developing ones.[end quote]
http://theyesmen.org/hijinks/wharton
[quote]Philadelphia - At a Wharton Business School conference on business in Africa, World Trade Organization representative Hanniford Schmidt announced the creation of a WTO initiative for "full private stewardry of labor" for the parts of Africa that have been hardest hit by the 500 years of Africa's free trade with the West.
The initiative will require Western companies doing business in some parts of Africa to own their workers outright. Schmidt recounted how private stewardship has been successfully applied to transport, power, water, traditional knowledge, and even the human genome. The WTO's "full private stewardry" program will extend these successes to (re)privatize humans themselves.
"Full, untrammelled stewardry is the best available solution to African poverty, and the inevitable result of free-market theory," Schmidt told more than 150 attendees. Schmidt acknowledged that the stewardry program was similar in many ways to slavery, but explained that just as "compassionate conservatism" has polished the rough edges on labor relations in industrialized countries, full stewardry, or "compassionate slavery," could be a similar boon to developing ones.[end quote]
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written by Contrarian View, February 09, 2010
People have done it. Motorcyclists have been killed or maimed. If it were merely fantasy I might not have reacted so strongly. But people have done it, so it isn't funny.
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written by DeusEx, February 09, 2010
Pinkhat, you do realize that the fundamental tenet of libertarianism and free market thought is that people should be free to make their own decisions, right? Pretending that the ownership of human beings is the natural result of libertarianism or free market economics is nonsensical and outright deceitful. You should be ashamed of yourself for even offering that as a comparison.
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written by Wilhite, February 09, 2010
@ North End Chick - so you say just go to the DEM and tell them that "someone" was f%&@king up our park. That's real effective.
@DeusEx - not sure I understand your line of thinking at all. So going to law enforcement is lame, but starting a fight with some guy in the woods who has two jeeps is a smart idea?
I think any of those answers are lame and really immature. Some of you think I should just pout. others think I should start a fight or somehow resolve the problem without law enforcement.
How about a little realism? We need to track this kind of activity and the people who are doing it or it will never stop. So, maybe the DEM law enforcement can't do anything about it now, but at least we have a track record to work off of.
@DeusEx - not sure I understand your line of thinking at all. So going to law enforcement is lame, but starting a fight with some guy in the woods who has two jeeps is a smart idea?
I think any of those answers are lame and really immature. Some of you think I should just pout. others think I should start a fight or somehow resolve the problem without law enforcement.
How about a little realism? We need to track this kind of activity and the people who are doing it or it will never stop. So, maybe the DEM law enforcement can't do anything about it now, but at least we have a track record to work off of.
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written by North End Chick, February 09, 2010
Actually using foul language in any situation won't get you far. And that wasn't what I said. I think ratting people out for something like this is silly and immature (or lame using your word). No...you can get your point across without taking license plates down and being a tattle tale.
We need to track these people down? Should we throw them in jail too? Being little harsh? No...it's just lame.
We need to track these people down? Should we throw them in jail too? Being little harsh? No...it's just lame.
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written by Wilhite, February 09, 2010
@North End Chick
I think you totally misunderstand my point or you think that tearing up our natural heritage is not so bad.
I'll assume the first, because I normally agree with your posts.
First, I don't condone getting into any altercation with anyone in the woods because you never know what the other person is capable of doing. So, I would never use foul language. I was being snide when I wrote that, because by not reporting the culprit, you aren't doing anything. So, how exactly would you get your point across without starting an altercation and without reporting the culprits?
Also, I'm not talking about tracking people down. But I absolutely believe that people should be held to account on this kind of activity. Are you aware of how many billions of dollars of destruction ATV users have caused on our public lands? This is not something "silly". this is a major problem in our country.
By the way, I was paraphrasing someone else's use of the word "lame".
I think you totally misunderstand my point or you think that tearing up our natural heritage is not so bad.
I'll assume the first, because I normally agree with your posts.
First, I don't condone getting into any altercation with anyone in the woods because you never know what the other person is capable of doing. So, I would never use foul language. I was being snide when I wrote that, because by not reporting the culprit, you aren't doing anything. So, how exactly would you get your point across without starting an altercation and without reporting the culprits?
Also, I'm not talking about tracking people down. But I absolutely believe that people should be held to account on this kind of activity. Are you aware of how many billions of dollars of destruction ATV users have caused on our public lands? This is not something "silly". this is a major problem in our country.
By the way, I was paraphrasing someone else's use of the word "lame".
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written by atheorist, February 10, 2010
Good for you Wilhite. It is a crime to destroy trails in what should be a quiet beautiful park. I have tried complaining too.
Town police do not consider this much of a crime. Heck, their own kids and friends do it. They are happy to beg off enforcement: "Call DEM police." DEM wrings their hands about how difficult it is to catch these offenders. DEM has no jurisdiction when they leave state property anyway. With their limited resources, they seem to be making their stand against this in Lincoln Woods and, with partial success, Arcadia.
Town police do not consider this much of a crime. Heck, their own kids and friends do it. They are happy to beg off enforcement: "Call DEM police." DEM wrings their hands about how difficult it is to catch these offenders. DEM has no jurisdiction when they leave state property anyway. With their limited resources, they seem to be making their stand against this in Lincoln Woods and, with partial success, Arcadia.
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written by krell, oswald, February 10, 2010
This is one of the most pathetic thread comments I've ever seen.
DeusEx seems to equate taking appropriate police action with big-gov't storm trooper tactics.
Leftyright calls it 'finking.' What, are we in third grade here?
Contrarian View is ready to execute right of center.
What is up with this, people? This was a state park. It belongs to all of us. If these people in their jeeps & ATVs are breaking the law, they should be stopped. That's called living in civil society.
DeusEx, what is up with this libertarian nonsense? People aren't saints. As a group, there are plenty of people who will take advantage of those weaker than they are. Having a police force to, well, enforce laws isn't repression. It's keeping a modicum of order, so that the rest of us can go about our business.
Get a grip, people. If something wrong is being done, the appropriate authorities should be notified. If they take no action, then the laws need to be strengthened and then enforced.
DeusEx seems to equate taking appropriate police action with big-gov't storm trooper tactics.
Leftyright calls it 'finking.' What, are we in third grade here?
Contrarian View is ready to execute right of center.
What is up with this, people? This was a state park. It belongs to all of us. If these people in their jeeps & ATVs are breaking the law, they should be stopped. That's called living in civil society.
DeusEx, what is up with this libertarian nonsense? People aren't saints. As a group, there are plenty of people who will take advantage of those weaker than they are. Having a police force to, well, enforce laws isn't repression. It's keeping a modicum of order, so that the rest of us can go about our business.
Get a grip, people. If something wrong is being done, the appropriate authorities should be notified. If they take no action, then the laws need to be strengthened and then enforced.
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written by DeusEx, February 10, 2010
Oswald, what you think is being astute is really just anti-intellectualism and closed-mindedness. You haven't "refuted" libertarianism with your broad and conclusory statements.
How would you like it if I came on here and just said:
"Oswald, what is up with this progressive nonsense? Government aren't saints. As a group, there are plenty who will abuse their political influence and the laws to take advantage of the less politically powerful. Having a free market isn't exploitation. It's keeping price levels down and quality up through fair competition so that most of us can get the goods we want."
See how that works? Not so fun when the other side is just spouting mindless talking points and propaganda, is it?
How would you like it if I came on here and just said:
"Oswald, what is up with this progressive nonsense? Government aren't saints. As a group, there are plenty who will abuse their political influence and the laws to take advantage of the less politically powerful. Having a free market isn't exploitation. It's keeping price levels down and quality up through fair competition so that most of us can get the goods we want."
See how that works? Not so fun when the other side is just spouting mindless talking points and propaganda, is it?
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Food for thought: how many people go tearing up Bill Gate's expansive property with ATV's?